Date: Mon, 24 Jun 2002 17:04:36 -0200

ao responder mensagem sobre o texto, Capoeira Qual é a Sua, veja LINK 00 em Debates.

The "1964 Interview with Mestre Pastinha" article was taken, with
permission, from the O Angoleiro newsletter of the International
Capoeira Angola Foundation (ICAF).  If you are interested in a subscription of
the O Angoleiro, please contact ICAF directly at ficadc@capoeira.org or
http://www.capoeira.org.

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Translation by Janaina Santos

Mestre Pastinha (Vincente Ferreira Pastinha b. April 5, 1889 - d.
November 13, 1981) was a bril liant capoeirista whose game was characterized by
agility, quickness and intelligence. He is to a great extent the
reason why Capoeira Angola did not died out as a legitimate martial arts
system.  Known as the great traditionalist, he wanted his students to understand the practice, philosophy and tradition of the pure Capoeira Angola.

In 1964, an anthropologist from Finland went to Brazil to research
Afrikan-Brazilian culture and white there conducted an interview with
Mestre Pastinha.  A tape of this interview along with other material was
recently discovered in Finland.

*INT: Interviewer from Finland
*MP:       Mestre Pastinha



INT:      Master, how long have you been playing Capoeira?
MP:      Since 1910.

INT:      Explain to me a little about Capoeira.
MP:      The explanation about the origin? The origin is Afrikan.

INT:      Where did you learn Capoeira?
MP:      Here in Bahia at 10 years old.

INT:      Who taught you?
MP:      An Afrikan.

INT:      What was his name?
MP:      He was called Benedito.

INT:      Is he from Angola?
MP:      Angola.

INT:      People say Capoeira is a fight but now it is becoming
prohibited as a fight.
MP:      No, Capoeira is not prohibited as a fight. Capoeira is
inside of a man. When he meets an enemy, he manifests Capoeira as a fight. But when he is happy, Capoeira becomes a dance.

INT:      How long have you had this space in Pelourihno?
MP:      Since 1952.
INT:      Have you ever gone to a foreign country?
MP:      I haven't gone yet. I had an opportunity that I lost which
was to go to Argentina but because I got an invitation for Sao Paulo I went to Sao Paulo instead of Argentina.

INT:      At what age do people learn Capoeira?
MP:      Any age.  Anybody can learn.

INT:      The boys who learn here generally are students and workers?
MP:      Yes, they are workers, construction workers, students,
employed in business.... Everything we have here.

INT:      So Capoeira is only a past-time?
MP:      Yes.

INT:      Do people only come here in their free time?
MP:      Yes.

INT:      So Capoeira isn't a livelihood.
MP:      No.

INT:      What is the difference between the old Capoeira and today's
Capoeira?
MP:      Before, it was the same thing. It is the same thing. It
doesn't have any modification. The modification is in the consideration from one man to another. If he has a vocation and comes with a happy spirit then we
play Capoeira with more obedience and more technique. But when the hate
comes, Capoeira also changes to a fight. In a happy attitude it is a dance. 
In an attitude of hate you already know how it is. It is for violence.

INT:      Have you personally carried a weapon?
MP:      No.

INT:      Capoeira is also present in Boa Viagem, Santa Barbara,
Santo Amaro, Cachoeira.
MP:      …Santo Amaro, Cachoeira..I am all over the place. Wher ever I
am invited I am going to.  Here we are ready to attend any purpose and that can
be any place where people are interested in Capoeira because then I will be
interested in going.

INT:      But where do you think the tradition of Capoeira Angola is
most pure? Here [in Bahia]?
MP:      Yes.

INT:      What do you think about Master Bimba?
MP:      Nothing I have to answer.  He has another purpose and about
others I can't address. On this one I can answer for it. But about the
other...  I know that he is a ....I respect Bimba, and I can't speak for his
purpose because he has his purpose and the only one who can say something is
him.

INT:      Of course, of course. He said that he presents a tradition
from Bahia.
Do you believe that he presents a tradition from Bahia?
MP: &n bsp;    He is from Bahia too. The tradition is the same. From me to
him and from him to me I think there isn't any modification.

INT:      Does he present more of a tradition from Africa?
MP:      He presented another modality that was named Regional. But
he was Angoleiro. He learned Angola.... He is as Angoleiro as I am... I
can't take that away from him.

INT:      But others like Waldemar and Caicara? Are they your
disciples?
MP:      Here I can't give another's purpose because I present mine.
I can't present the other purpose.

INT:      But I am asking if it is still an Afrikan tradition.
MP:       It is. The tradition is the same but they have their
declaration, which is different. He learned with another master and I can't say
anything.

INT: & nbsp;    What is the future plan with Capoeira?
MP:      The Capoeira future is this: It is here in the function of
the man. Then comes also the human evolution. But he has to manifest this inside the Capoeira itself. It can't get out, no it can't be outside.

INT:      When people start to salute the Capoeira, that means that
there is a religious meaning?
MP:      Capoeira is religious. It comes from the same religion as
Candomble, as the Batuque and the Samba. Candomble is and has the same amount of religious meaning but now with the modification it is a little bit different. The manifestation is a little bit different but the amount is the same. The religion is the same.

INT:      People say that there is a rivalry between Candomble and
Capoeira.
MP:   It doesn't have rivalry; it is together. The Capoeirista  is
the same as a Candomble priest. Now he has abandoned one part for another. We
follow the Candomble priest. We practice the Candomble. If it wasn't like
that we wouldn't go in the Candomble house. We are from the same base. But
now, one runs to Capoerismo, the other to Candomble.

INT:      Of course, of course.

END.

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